Lunar Eclipses in Saros Series 34

This page lists all the lunar eclipses in saros series 34. The series contains 72 eclipses, occurring over 1280 years.

This series is partnered with solar Saros series 41.

Note that eclipse dates are specified relative to UT. You have not selected a timezone for eclipse timings, so all times are shown in UT (essentially GMT).
12 May, 1616 BC
max: 16:30 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.13; Saros 34)
In this extremely marginal eclipse, the Moon barely clipped the edge of the Earth's penumbral shadow. This caused a microscopic darkening of just 13% of the Moon's disc for 1 hour and 34 minutes, which was essentially impossible to see.
   
23 May, 1598 BC
max: 23:59 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.26; Saros 34)
This very subtle penumbral eclipse was essentially invisible to the naked eye; though it lasted 2 hours and 12 minutes, just 26% of the Moon's disc was in partial shadow (with no part of it in complete shadow).
   
3 Jun, 1580 BC
max: 07:28 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.39; Saros 34)
This very subtle penumbral eclipse was essentially invisible to the naked eye; though it lasted 2 hours and 41 minutes, just 39% of the Moon's disc was in partial shadow (with no part of it in complete shadow).
   
14 Jun, 1562 BC
max: 14:58 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.51; Saros 34)
This very subtle penumbral eclipse was essentially invisible to the naked eye; though it lasted 3 hours and 3 minutes, just 51% of the Moon's disc was in partial shadow (with no part of it in complete shadow).
   
24 Jun, 1544 BC
max: 22:32 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.63; Saros 34)
This subtle penumbral eclipse may have been visible to a skilled observer at maximum eclipse. 63% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth (none of it was in total shadow), which caused a gentle shadow gradient across its disc at maximum; the eclipse as a whole lasted 3 hours and 22 minutes.
   
6 Jul, 1526 BC
max: 06:08 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.75; Saros 34)
This subtle penumbral eclipse may have been visible to a skilled observer at maximum eclipse. 75% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth (none of it was in total shadow), which caused a gentle shadow gradient across its disc at maximum; the eclipse as a whole lasted 3 hours and 38 minutes.
   
16 Jul, 1508 BC
max: 13:50 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.86; Saros 34)
At maximum eclipse, 86% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth, which caused a slight shadow gradient across its disc; this subtle effect may have been visible to careful observers. No part of the Moon was in complete shadow. The eclipse lasted 3 hours and 51 minutes overall.
   
27 Jul, 1490 BC
max: 21:38 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.96; Saros 34)
The Moon approached within 0% of the Earth's umbral shadow at maximum eclipse; 96% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth, with the overall eclipse lasting 4 hours and 2 minutes. While less dramatic than a partial eclipse (as no part of the Moon was in complete shadow), a shading across the Moon should have been readily visible to observers.
   
7 Aug, 1472 BC
max: 05:33 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.08; Saros 34)
A tiny bite out of the Moon may have been visible at maximum, though just 8% of the Moon was shadowed in a partial eclipse which lasted for 1 hour and 3 minutes. A shading across the moon from the Earth's penumbral shadow should have been visible at maximum eclipse.
   
18 Aug, 1454 BC
max: 13:35 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.16; Saros 34)
At maximum eclipse, a small bite out of the Moon should have been visible. The eclipse lasted for 1 hour and 25 minutes, with just 16% of the Moon in shadow at maximum.
   
28 Aug, 1436 BC
max: 21:44 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.21; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 21% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 1 hour and 40 minutes.
   
9 Sep, 1418 BC
max: 06:01 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.26; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 26% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 1 hour and 50 minutes.
   
19 Sep, 1400 BC
max: 14:25 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.30; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 30% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 1 hour and 57 minutes.
   
30 Sep, 1382 BC
max: 22:56 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.32; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 32% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 1 minute.
   
11 Oct, 1364 BC
max: 07:33 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.33; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 33% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 4 minutes.
   
22 Oct, 1346 BC
max: 16:14 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.34; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 34% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 5 minutes.
   
2 Nov, 1328 BC
max: 00:59 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.34; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 34% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 5 minutes.
   
13 Nov, 1310 BC
max: 09:46 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.33; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 33% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 5 minutes.
   
23 Nov, 1292 BC
max: 18:34 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.33; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 33% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 4 minutes.
   
5 Dec, 1274 BC
max: 03:20 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.32; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 32% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 3 minutes.
   
15 Dec, 1256 BC
max: 12:03 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.32; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 32% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 3 minutes.
   
26 Dec, 1238 BC
max: 20:40 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.33; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 33% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 4 minutes.
   
6 Jan, 1219 BC
max: 05:13 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.34; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 34% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 7 minutes.
   
17 Jan, 1201 BC
max: 13:35 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.36; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 36% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 11 minutes.
   
27 Jan, 1183 BC
max: 21:51 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.40; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 40% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 17 minutes.
   
8 Feb, 1165 BC
max: 05:55 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.44; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 44% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 24 minutes.
   
18 Feb, 1147 BC
max: 13:50 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.50; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 50% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 33 minutes.
   
29 Feb, 1129 BC
max: 21:33 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.58; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 58% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 43 minutes.
   
12 Mar, 1111 BC
max: 05:08 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.67; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 2 hours and 53 minutes, with 67% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
22 Mar, 1093 BC
max: 12:31 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.77; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 3 minutes, with 77% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
2 Apr, 1075 BC
max: 19:46 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.89; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 13 minutes, with 89% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
13 Apr, 1057 BC
max: 02:52 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.01; Saros 34)
The Moon barely edged into total eclipse for just 16 minutes and 42 seconds. With the Moon just 1% of its diameter into the Earth's umbral shadow, the Moon may have been quite bright, but even so, this should have been worth seeing. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 22 minutes in total.
   
24 Apr, 1039 BC
max: 09:50 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.15; Saros 34)
A shallow total eclipse saw the Moon in relative darkness for 58 minutes and 24 seconds. The Moon was 15% of its diameter into the Earth's umbral shadow, and should have been significantly darkened. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 30 minutes in total.
   
4 May, 1021 BC
max: 16:43 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.29; Saros 34)
The Moon was plunged into darkness for 1 hour and 19 minutes, in a deep total eclipse which saw the Moon 29% of its diameter inside the Earth's umbral shadow. The visual effect of this depends on the state of the Earth's atmosphere, but the Moon may have been stained a deep red colour. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 37 minutes in total.
   
15 May, 1003 BC
max: 23:31 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.44; Saros 34)
The Moon was plunged into darkness for 1 hour and 32 minutes, in a deep total eclipse which saw the Moon 44% of its diameter inside the Earth's umbral shadow. The visual effect of this depends on the state of the Earth's atmosphere, but the Moon may have been stained a deep red colour. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 43 minutes in total.
   
26 May, 0985 BC
max: 06:16 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.59; Saros 34)
A dramatic total eclipse lasting 1 hour and 40 minutes plunged the full Moon into deep darkness, as it passed right through the centre of the Earth's umbral shadow. While the visual effect of a total eclipse is variable, the Moon may have been stained a deep orange or red colour at maximum eclipse. This was a great spectacle for everyone who saw it. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 47 minutes in total.
   
6 Jun, 0967 BC
max: 13:00 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.74; Saros 34)
A dramatic total eclipse lasting 1 hour and 44 minutes plunged the full Moon into deep darkness, as it passed right through the centre of the Earth's umbral shadow. While the visual effect of a total eclipse is variable, the Moon may have been stained a deep orange or red colour at maximum eclipse. This was a great spectacle for everyone who saw it. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 50 minutes in total.
   
16 Jun, 0949 BC
max: 19:43 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.79; Saros 34)
A dramatic total eclipse lasting 1 hour and 45 minutes plunged the full Moon into deep darkness, as it passed right through the centre of the Earth's umbral shadow. While the visual effect of a total eclipse is variable, the Moon may have been stained a deep orange or red colour at maximum eclipse. This was a great spectacle for everyone who saw it. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 51 minutes in total.
   
28 Jun, 0931 BC
max: 02:28 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.64; Saros 34)
A dramatic total eclipse lasting 1 hour and 42 minutes plunged the full Moon into deep darkness, as it passed right through the centre of the Earth's umbral shadow. While the visual effect of a total eclipse is variable, the Moon may have been stained a deep orange or red colour at maximum eclipse. This was a great spectacle for everyone who saw it. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 50 minutes in total.
   
8 Jul, 0913 BC
max: 09:15 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.50; Saros 34)
The Moon was plunged into darkness for 1 hour and 36 minutes, in a deep total eclipse which saw the Moon 50% of its diameter inside the Earth's umbral shadow. The visual effect of this depends on the state of the Earth's atmosphere, but the Moon may have been stained a deep red colour. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 48 minutes in total.
   
19 Jul, 0895 BC
max: 16:08 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.36; Saros 34)
The Moon was plunged into darkness for 1 hour and 27 minutes, in a deep total eclipse which saw the Moon 36% of its diameter inside the Earth's umbral shadow. The visual effect of this depends on the state of the Earth's atmosphere, but the Moon may have been stained a deep red colour. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 44 minutes in total.
   
29 Jul, 0877 BC
max: 23:04 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.23; Saros 34)
The Moon was plunged into darkness for 1 hour and 13 minutes, in a deep total eclipse which saw the Moon 23% of its diameter inside the Earth's umbral shadow. The visual effect of this depends on the state of the Earth's atmosphere, but the Moon may have been stained a deep red colour. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 40 minutes in total.
   
10 Aug, 0859 BC
max: 06:10 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.12; Saros 34)
A shallow total eclipse saw the Moon in relative darkness for 54 minutes and 30 seconds. The Moon was 12% of its diameter into the Earth's umbral shadow, and should have been significantly darkened. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 35 minutes in total.
   
20 Aug, 0841 BC
max: 13:20 UT
Total Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 1.02; Saros 34)
The Moon barely edged into total eclipse for 20 minutes and 12 seconds. With the Moon just 2% of its diameter into the Earth's umbral shadow, the Moon may have been quite bright, but even so, this should have been worth seeing. The partial eclipse lasted for 3 hours and 29 minutes in total.
   
31 Aug, 0823 BC
max: 20:41 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.93; Saros 34)
The Moon was almost covered by the Earth's shadow in a very deep partial eclipse, which lasted 3 hours and 24 minutes. With 93% of the Moon in shadow at maximum eclipse, this was quite a memorable event.
   
11 Sep, 0805 BC
max: 04:08 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.85; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 18 minutes, with 85% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
22 Sep, 0787 BC
max: 11:46 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.79; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 13 minutes, with 79% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
2 Oct, 0769 BC
max: 19:30 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.74; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 9 minutes, with 74% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
14 Oct, 0751 BC
max: 03:21 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.70; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 6 minutes, with 70% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
24 Oct, 0733 BC
max: 11:19 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.68; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 3 minutes, with 68% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
4 Nov, 0715 BC
max: 19:22 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.66; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours and 1 minute, with 66% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
15 Nov, 0697 BC
max: 03:27 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.65; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 3 hours exactly, with 65% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
26 Nov, 0679 BC
max: 11:35 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.64; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 2 hours and 59 minutes, with 64% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
6 Dec, 0661 BC
max: 19:41 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.63; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 2 hours and 58 minutes, with 63% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
18 Dec, 0643 BC
max: 03:46 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.62; Saros 34)
The Moon was strikingly shadowed in this deep partial eclipse which lasted 2 hours and 57 minutes, with 62% of the Moon in darkness at maximum.
   
28 Dec, 0625 BC
max: 11:46 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.60; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 60% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 55 minutes.
   
8 Jan, 0606 BC
max: 19:42 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.58; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 58% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 52 minutes.
   
19 Jan, 0588 BC
max: 03:29 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.54; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 54% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 48 minutes.
   
30 Jan, 0570 BC
max: 11:09 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.50; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 50% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 42 minutes.
   
9 Feb, 0552 BC
max: 18:39 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.44; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 44% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 33 minutes.
   
21 Feb, 0534 BC
max: 02:01 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.37; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 37% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 22 minutes.
   
3 Mar, 0516 BC
max: 09:13 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.28; Saros 34)
The Earth's shadow on the moon was clearly visible in this eclipse, with 28% of the Moon in shadow; the partial eclipse lasted for 2 hours and 6 minutes.
   
14 Mar, 0498 BC
max: 16:17 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.18; Saros 34)
At maximum eclipse, a small bite out of the Moon should have been visible. The eclipse lasted for 1 hour and 43 minutes, with just 18% of the Moon in shadow at maximum.
   
24 Mar, 0480 BC
max: 23:13 UT
Partial Lunar Eclipse
(umbral mag. 0.07; Saros 34)
A tiny bite out of the Moon may have been visible at maximum, though just 7% of the Moon was shadowed in a partial eclipse which lasted for 1 hour and 6 minutes. A shading across the moon from the Earth's penumbral shadow should have been visible at maximum eclipse.
   
5 Apr, 0462 BC
max: 06:02 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 1.02; Saros 34)
In a rare total penumbral eclipse, the entire Moon was partially shaded by the Earth (though none of it was in complete shadow), and the shading across the Moon should have been quite visible at maximum eclipse. The penumbral phase lasted for 4 hours and 45 minutes in all, though for most of it, the eclipse was extremely difficult or impossible to see.
   
15 Apr, 0444 BC
max: 12:45 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.89; Saros 34)
This subtle penumbral eclipse may have been visible to a skilled observer at maximum eclipse. 89% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth (none of it was in total shadow), which caused a gentle shadow gradient across its disc at maximum; the eclipse as a whole lasted 4 hours and 29 minutes.
   
26 Apr, 0426 BC
max: 19:22 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.75; Saros 34)
This subtle penumbral eclipse may have been visible to a skilled observer at maximum eclipse. 75% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth (none of it was in total shadow), which caused a gentle shadow gradient across its disc at maximum; the eclipse as a whole lasted 4 hours and 9 minutes.
   
7 May, 0408 BC
max: 01:56 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.60; Saros 34)
This subtle penumbral eclipse may have been visible to a skilled observer at maximum eclipse. 60% of the Moon's disc was partially shaded by the Earth (none of it was in total shadow), which caused a gentle shadow gradient across its disc at maximum; the eclipse as a whole lasted 3 hours and 46 minutes.
   
18 May, 0390 BC
max: 08:28 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.45; Saros 34)
This very subtle penumbral eclipse was essentially invisible to the naked eye; though it lasted 3 hours and 18 minutes, just 45% of the Moon's disc was in partial shadow (with no part of it in complete shadow).
   
28 May, 0372 BC
max: 14:59 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.30; Saros 34)
This very subtle penumbral eclipse was essentially invisible to the naked eye; though it lasted 2 hours and 43 minutes, just 30% of the Moon's disc was in partial shadow (with no part of it in complete shadow).
   
8 Jun, 0354 BC
max: 21:31 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.15; Saros 34)
In this extremely marginal eclipse, the Moon barely clipped the edge of the Earth's penumbral shadow. This caused a microscopic darkening of just 15% of the Moon's disc for 1 hour and 57 minutes, which was essentially impossible to see.
   
19 Jun, 0336 BC
max: 04:08 UT
Penumbral Lunar Eclipse
(penum. mag. 0.01; Saros 34)
In this virtually non-existant eclipse, the Moon barely clipped the edge of the Earth's penumbral shadow; although the eclipse lasted 27 minutes and 42 seconds, it was impossible to see in practice.